Winning strategy in multiplayer Tetris DS [split topic]

1. Rosti LFC

Digital has it for me really.

With Tetris DS, it's really hard to take a situation with two scenarios, neither of which is obviously worse, and to say "this one is better". There are far too many variables, especially against an opponent.

You do have the predictability of the randomiser to help you though. If you know you've not had Z's in a while, you could quite easily use tepples' setup.

2. evybabeeUnregistered

wow that's pretty interesting. i think i have always tended to choose A in that situation, maybe because it keeps my stack more level or it looks somehow more esthetically pleasing, but now thinking about it it seems that B seems like a far better choice for the next pieces to be able to fit and to be able to build properly in the near future (given that your next piece isn't a Z). i'm glad you presented this question because this situation comes up a lot, and i will be opting for B from now on.

i've always tended to stack flush against the left wall, and if play or garbage received should shift my column somewhere in between, i would always try to fix this immediately so that i could go back to having it on one side far-left or far-right (as most players do).. but i've noticed lately from playing against the really good players from japan (on Splash multi), that they are much more open to leaving the column in the middle. i think this makes it much easier to stack for tetrises and at the same time be able to layer them with t-spins and so forth to get back-to-back bonuses as well. of course, it's much easier to stack to one side, but i've changed my strategy in multiplayer (splash & ds) now to not instantly trying to get back to having my column on far-right or far-left.

i'm curious what all of you think. is it "incorrect" to leave your open column in the centre or is it a more advanced strategy?

3. Altimora.k.a. Ghett0

It'd work for TDS and Splash, but, as the 20g TGM-ers know, never, EVER, make tetris column in the middle in 20g.

4. DIGITALUnregistered

A strategy is only as advanced as you make it. Really, I don't think there is a correct way to position a column. It's highly relative to the situation. That means as the round progresses, you'll have to change where you place your column. Here are some general things to keep in mind.

If you open with a column on the right, you have more field room and flexibility. You also have the spawn orientation advantage. Passively, you'll have an easier time keeping the field flat which can lend itself to non-overstacking construction. The drawback is that you'll have a reduced opportunity of setting up T-Spin Doubles. However, in such games as TDS, where wallkick T-Spins are allowed, the Yoshihiro SD makes up for this.

If you open with a column in the center, you'll be able to set up more T-Spin Doubles. You'll also be able to drop the T and I quickly. Drawback is that you'll have to split your stack in two. You won't have as much field flexibility. Also, you'll have to scoot pieces a little further to the right but that's not really a problem if the game has fast DAS.

I think it's wisest to keep your options open and incorporate both types of columns in your play. My advice is to stack where the open column leads you.

5. jujubeUnregistered

i believe it's a good idea to become proficient with the open column anywhere in your playing field, but whatever works in the beginning of the game works. because you never know how the garbage will work out, it's good to have things to look for with the open column anywhere. with this in mind:

column 1 or 10 is open: Yoshihiro

column 2 or 9 is open: Triple-Double

column 3 or 8 is open: Double-Triple

but probably more important than knowing these things is knowing when not to try them. it depends a lot on the previews and the points that Digital made above in general. some people will say you can't win a game with these setups, that you would've won anyway, or you lost because you went for it (even when the situation told you it was correct). the truth is that many players slow down significantly when attempting them, or they have no clue when not to try them.

i would say practice forcing them against the CPU in TDS, because it's the only way to learn. once you know the setups, examine the games in which you use them, and objectively decide whether or not the setup should've been attempted (being honest with yourself is important here). when you know when not to use a setup, you might go several games without considering using it. when your overall winning percentage increases, you know the setup.

6. emaUnregistered

Thank you for using my editor.

http://ema.fsr.jp/tetris_editor/

I append English resource for it.

I tested on Firefox 3 beta2. but it probably works on other browsers.

7. DIGITALUnregistered

Thanks for making it easier for us English users, ema.

8. Rosti LFC

For any game that uses SRS, it doesn't matter where you put the column really. If it isn't 20G, then the middle is probably more preferable, because it is less awkward to get the I-piece into the column if you're right at the top.

With ARS though, choosing to leave the column anywhere other than against the right wall is just going to needlessly handicap yourself.

9. jujubeUnregistered

thank you ema

10. lee n

It would never work with ARS, that's for sure.. but with SRS you probably could.

11. DIGITALUnregistered

It doesn't work in SRS either since gravity is processed before rotation.

12. tepplesLockjaw developer

Only because TDS has no initial rotation. But would it be possible to do it in the order ZJZ?

Code:
|     |  |     |  |JJ    |  |JJ    |
|     |  |     |  |J    |  |JZZ   |
|     |  | Z    |  |JZ    |  |JZZZ   |
| SS   |  |ZZSS   |  |ZZSS   |  |ZZSS   |
| SS   | => |ZSS   | => |ZSS   | => |ZSS   |
|GGGG GGGGG|  |GGGG GGGGG|  |GGGG GGGGG|  |GGGG GGGGG|

13. lee n

Wouldn't the blue piece land here:

14. DIGITALUnregistered

Yes that works but you changed the order to ZJZ as tepples did in the previous post.

well, i feel that using Z piece is good. of course, if we place the Z piece on the left side, new hollow will be created between Z and wall. however, there is important a difference between the new hollow and old one. the old one can't accept L piece as well as O, on the other hand the new one can do the L piece. we can get stable field more ,can't we ?

case 1) between S and wall

case 2) between S+Z and wall

case 3) between S+I
coming back, when we choose I piece, i think we may as well pay attention to the risk created by it . i have a little shivering fit from the high tower of light blue. were it not for luck, we could be mortally injured.

case 4) between S+J
then, we have to take account of the option of J piece. at first sight, this situation seems difficult, but there is not so difficult for us. i remember such a tactics of stacking on assumption that player is compensating for the shortage was often used by SEN/SEN.

not being prepossessed with 11 space, he seemed to have used his interest with noticing the level lines. though it is off the subject, he often used the tactics, as if it had been natural.

ex) SEN's tactics

i have tried to make up for difference between leading players and me with knowledge or experience, but still i feel the conclusively something else.ah, for instance, though i philosophically recognize Prophecy T-Spins as knowledge, star players like NOAH seemed to me to have felt "sense" instinctively.
i feel experience is a little different from "sense"
i'm not sure...i think experience is the artificial sense, on the other hand "sense "what i mean is more intuitive.

well, wherever the column is,Yoshihiro? tries to shoot "Yoshihiro SD" or "Kaidan" to us like a hunter. just like this

ex) Yoshihiro SD in the middle

16. DIGITALUnregistered

I believe the intuitive sense is a more developed form of experience. Some pick up and process experience in a more efficient manner. Experience is equivalent from one player to another, and two players with the same amount of experience will be around the same level. It's just that some players gain experience faster than others. I also think it's important to note that experience does not have to be expressed to be evident.

Yeah, it's true that the Yoshihiro SD can be set up in the middle as well. I think it's easier on the side though because you have more room to stack and flatten the area necessary for the setup.

17. emaUnregistered

I got great experiences from other players. I'm lucky to live in Japan, and I can see cool play in live, can get advices from them. I will never get a sense, if I played alone. So I want to express these experiences as much as possible someday. my videos and my editor are the toehold for it

Sorry to steer the conversation away from the topic.

If you want anything or found a bug on my editor.

Please register a ticket to http://tage.mydns.jp/.

It may realize in the future, or not realize

18. thomasgx1Unregistered

umm, excuse my ignorance but wouldn't it be a good idea to whack that S shape on the far right standing up for something to slip underneath it next go?

19. DIGITALUnregistered

You could but then you'd be missing out on a T-Spin opportunity.

20. caffeine

right, since you'll need to soft drop no matter what (aside from some risky situations), you may as well t-spin.