Keyboard VS Joystick

Thread in 'Hardware' started by Amnesia, 10 Mar 2008.

  1. Zaphod77

    Zaphod77 Resident Misinformer

    A high quality stick is probably the best way to play, when learned.

    zangi-moves are really easy with a good stick, and hellishly fast. It's a bit trickier to do a zangi move on a keyboard, bu tnot impossible.

    THat said, i think straight sonic drop followed by lock is faster on a keyboard than a stick. That is probably where a keyboard player makes up the most of their speed, but then loses it in the zangi-moves.
  2. generally, zangi moves won't make much of a difference. this is because they're only applicable during low G, which is almost always coupled with high ARE. with high ARE, you have plenty of thought time to execute it just perfectly.

    DIGITAL Unregistered

    I'm just going to reemphasize a point that Amnesia brought up. TGM is a version of Tetris, but Tetris is not a version of TGM. Arguments that may work with the former can be invalidated by the latter. So yeah, don't generalize and center your argument on one, please. [​IMG]
  4. Amnesia

    Amnesia Piece of Cake


    Maybe I have not understood very well..I could bet my two hands on this point, even if it is you zaphod who say that..

    Unless you put some lubricant on the button, I don't see how a keyboard could make more easily a drop/lock move..
  5. Zaphod77

    Zaphod77 Resident Misinformer

    with keyboard, you can double press the keys very quickly.

    you press up arrow a split second before down arrow, and it's a nearly instant hard lock.

    to do a zangi that is 3 or 4 keypresses, and a bit trickier to do at high speed. the joystick player is much more at ease.

    So i believe that stick is faster for zangis, which do add up.

    While it may be easier to press two quickly on a keyboar,d amny mves require more than 2 presses, and those i think will usually end up slower on a keyboard.

    DIGITAL Unregistered

    There seems to be some strange general misconception that a keyboard sucks for sub-20G. I'll say this. Keyboards suck for sub-20G IN TGM because of the lack of hard drop and the stacking logic and finesse that accompanies it. Don't tell me about firm drop and lock because it's a fact that it's slower than one button press. It follows the logic of having two CCW buttons.

    Another thing, don't compare the speed thresholds of keyboard vs. joystick with contrasting game elements like sub-20G vs. 20G. The thresholds of speed may differ wildly on different control mediums. The Lockjaw 40L and 180 sec thread is an entirely different beast in itself.

    Lastly, we don't have any objective proof of what's faster than what. Yeah, keyboard players on TC may have the edge in Shirase clones at the moment. And yes, Japanese players may have the edge in TGM in general. But we shouldn't assume that this is attributed to control medium supiority. There are so many factors involved.
  7. Zaphod77

    Zaphod77 Resident Misinformer

    you can hard lock on tgm just as fast with a keyboard.

    it's really easy to press two keys, one RIGHT after the other. it's when you go up to 3 or 4 keys that you start slowing down.
  8. jujube

    jujube Unregistered

    i bet i can press kjf at least as fast as a joystick player can go up,left,down.
  9. Zaphod77

    Zaphod77 Resident Misinformer

    that's assuming you have a brain capable of understanding such non intuitive keyboard layouts. That's certainly beyond me.

    Try ILK or IKM or IL, instead and see how fast you can do it. [​IMG]
  10. jujube

    jujube Unregistered

    it just takes a little longer to learn a non intuitive layout. but what's so intuitive about using the arrow keys anyway? doesn't a keyboard player have to get used to those? why does "up" make the piece go down? [​IMG]

    no way! that would almost definitely require using the same finger for more than one key, which i try to avoid [​IMG]

    DIGITAL Unregistered

    Yeah, non-intuitive inputs give keyboards the edge in theoretical speeds. But when it comes down to "practical" standards, those layouts just don't work as well unless you train and specialize in it. I feel the "finger roll" for the up down motion of firm dropping on a keyboard to be highly unintuitive as well but others may feel differently.
  12. If speed is all that matters, then surely Typomino would be the fastest.
  13. jujube

    jujube Unregistered

    but unfortunately no one around here has spent enough time learning typomino. it's tempting to play at 1.5 kpt but you have to use so many different keys. i bet somebody somewhere is gonna get really fast at it though.
  14. I don't find a joystick to be faster for sub-20G. Double-tapping with a keyboard is just so much quicker.

    DIGITAL Unregistered

    That's the thing though. It has such a sharp learning curve that I don't think anybody would be willing to dedicate that much time to it, especially if they can play quite fast on other "less efficient" control mediums.
  16. it's got deep drop. boo.
  17. jujube

    jujube Unregistered

    hopefully in future versions deep drop can be turned off. the game is playable without it.
  18. Zaphod77

    Zaphod77 Resident Misinformer

    and completely uneeded for most placements.

    Under ARS.

    7 out of 9 are reachable for the square without double tapping.

    7 of 8 are available for the 3 wide pieces from their initial orientation.

    and all 7 are available for the I piece.

    The i can be dropped into any column without pressing twice in the same direction.

    A Z can be dropped into 1-2, 2-3, 3-4, 4-5, 5-6, 6-7 9-10, and 8-9

    A S can be dropped into 1-2, 2-3,3-4,4-5,5-6, 7-8,8-9,and 9-10.

    A T, L, or a J can be dropped vertically as a S or a Z depending on orientation.

    Expert play consist of avoiding these dead spots that require double taps, I'm told.

    DIGITAL Unregistered

    Perhaps it's not the tapping that makes the difference in sub-20G but in direction switching taps under no delays. Keyboard players don't have to return to neutral after DASing or tapping.
  20. I don't put into question the fact that double taps are less efficient, but I think with a keyboard a double-tap can be performed faster, or at least just as fast, as some of the manoeuvres with a joystick, which can often be counter-intuitive.

    Or maybe it's just quite a blatant reminder of how sloppy my finesse is on TGM.

Share This Page