I can't get T-Spins to work >_<

Thread in 'Discussion' started by niku, 1 Jun 2006.

  1. niku

    niku Unregistered

    Whenever I get a T-spin, it's totally on accident. If I set one up and try to get it, the T block just pops back up to the top when I rotate it. What am I doing wrong? >_<



    Edit: I forgot to mention that I'm referring to Tetris DS
     
  2. X-Perts

    X-Perts Unregistered

    Ok here goes. This is basically everything you need to know...


    A t-spin occurs when you rotate the T-block to move into a space that it shouldn't naturally fit into, OR can only fit into by rotation.


    Let me show you.

    T-Spin(Clears no lines):

    __________

    __________

    _T________

    TTT_______

    _XXXX_____


    Rotate Clockwise


    Normally the piece would look like this:

    (WRONG)

    __________

    __________

    _T________

    _TT_______

    _TXXX_____

    (Notice that the two blocks overlap where it is bold)


    Instead, the piece will end up like this:

    (RIGHT)

    __________

    __________

    T_________

    TT________

    TXXXX_____




    T-Spin Single(Clears one line):

    __________

    _________T

    XXXXXXXXTT

    XXXXXXX__T


    Rotate Clockwize:

    (WRONG)

    __________

    _________T

    XXXXXXXXTTT

    XXXXXXX___

    (Obviously this won't work)


    Instead, the piece will end up like this:

    (RIGHT)


    __________

    __________

    XXXXXXXXT_

    XXXXXXXTTT




    T-Spin Double(Clears two line):

    __________

    ____TXX___

    XXXTT_XXXX

    XXXXTXXXXX


    Rotate CounterClockwize:

    <b>(RIGHT)</b>


    __________

    _____XX___

    XXXTTTXXXX

    XXXXTXXXXX




    T-Spin Triple(Clears Three lines):

    __________

    ____TXX___

    ___TTTX___

    XXXXX_XXXX

    XXXX__XXXX

    XXXXX_XXXX


    Rotate CounterClockwise


    Normally the piece would look like this:

    (WRONG)

    __________

    ____TXX___

    ___TT_X___

    XXXXT_XXXX

    XXXX__XXXX

    XXXXX_XXXX

    (Notice that the two blocks overlap where it is bold)


    Instead, the piece will end up like this:

    (RIGHT)

    __________

    _____XX___

    ______X___

    XXXXXTXXXX

    XXXXTTXXXX

    XXXXXTXXXX



    Take note that these are not the only ways to perform t-spins, but these are the most common.




    This is what T-Spin's (And Tetrises) will do:


    T-Spin - 100 pts (Also sends 0 line)


    T-Spin single - 200 pts (Also sends 2 lines)

    BtoB - 300 pts (Also sends 3 lines)


    T-Spin double - 1200 pts (Also sends 4 lines)

    BtoB - 1800 pts (Also sends 5 lines)


    T-Spin triple - 1600 pts (Also Sends 6 lines)

    BtoB - 2400 pts (also sends 7 lines)
     
  3. tepples

    tepples Lockjaw developer

    Why does the game count this as a T-spin when the piece could have been dropped in that orientation from above? In The New Tetris, a T-spin happens when a piece lands and it cannot move left, right, or up. But Tetris DS recognizes some T-spins that TNT doesn't (such as the above) and fails to recognize others that TNT does (such as a few T-spin singles similar to the double below). Has anybody reversed TDS's formula?

    Remove one of the X blocks on the bottom row, and the T-spin won't be recognized.


    This is an anomaly in the wall kick rules used by SRS games such as TDS. The more obvious wall kick rule, used by TGM, would end up like this:


    ____T_____

    ___TTXX___

    ____T_X___

    XXXXX_XXXX

    XXXX__XXXX

    XXXXX_XXXX
     
  4. I thought it was: Every T-move that uses a wallkick (and no further movement) is a T-spin.




    Pro Tip: Using "Code" instead of "Quote" will use a monospace font.

    Code:
    T-Spin Double(Clears two line): 
    __________ 
    ____TXX___ 
    XXXTT_XXXX 
    XXXXTXXXXX 
    
    Rotate CounterClockwize: 
    <b>(RIGHT)</b> 
    
    __________ 
    _____XX___ 
    XXXTTTXXXX 
    XXXXTXXXXX
    Code:
    T-Spin Double(Clears two line): 
    __________ 
    ____TXX___ 
    XXXTT_XXXX 
    XXXXTXXXXX 
    
    Rotate CounterClockwize: 
    <b>(RIGHT)</b> 
    
    __________ 
    _____XX___ 
    XXXTTTXXXX 
    XXXXTXXXXX
    Code:
    T-Spin Triple(Clears Three lines): 
    __________ 
    ____TXX___ 
    ___TTTX___ 
    XXXXX_XXXX 
    XXXX__XXXX 
    XXXXX_XXXX 
    
    Rotate CounterClockwise 
    
    Normally the piece would look like this: 
    (WRONG) 
    __________ 
    ____TXX___ 
    ___TT_X___ 
    XXXXT_XXXX 
    XXXX__XXXX 
    XXXXX_XXXX 
    (Notice that the two blocks overlap where it is bold) 
    
    Instead, the piece will end up like this: 
    (RIGHT) 
    __________ 
    _____XX___ 
    ______X___ 
    XXXXXTXXXX 
    XXXXTTXXXX 
    XXXXXTXXXX
    Code:
    This is an anomaly in the wall kick rules used by SRS games such as TDS. The more obvious wall kick rule, used by TGM, would end up like this: 
    
    ____T_____ 
    ___TTXX___ 
    ____T_X___ 
    XXXXX_XXXX 
    XXXX__XXXX 
    XXXXX_XXXX
    And, to nitpick, under Sega/TGM rotations this final example would in fact not be a wallkick. It would be the default rotation.
     
  5. tepples

    tepples Lockjaw developer

    Doesn't help in the case of


    Code:
    __________ 
    ____TXX___ 
    XXXTT_XXXX 
    XXXXTXXXXX 
    
    counterclockwise
    __________ 
    _____XX___ 
    XXXTTTXXXX 
    XXXXTXXXXX 
    
    No wallkick here, but it's still recognized. However, if you take out one of the lower blocks it doesn't recognize it.
     
  6. Well, the simplest explanation I can think of is:


    T placements ending in a wallkick, and also that specific move hackily included.
     
  7. X-Perts

    X-Perts Unregistered

    From what I've figured out, HOW a T block got where it did, is less important than WHERE it ended up.

    Basically, the requirement to CHECK for a t-Spin is that the last input was a rotation NOT a direction.


    Once it starts to check for a T-spin, all it has to do is check if three of the four spaces around the block are occupied.



    Code:
    Here's an example:
    
      #XXXXX      
    XXXTTTXXXXX
    XXX#T#XXXXX
    
    *The T can point in any direction for this example to work
    
    In this game, the walls (non-playable margins) are counted as occupied spaces. That's why my example of a T-Spin single can be performed.
    Code:
    Here's an example:
    
    W     W
    W     W
    #T    W
    WTT XXXXXXXW
    #T#XXXXXXXXW
    
    *In this example, Normal blocks could take the place of the wall
    
     
  8. tepples

    tepples Lockjaw developer

    And TDS recognizes only the T tetromino, unlike TNT. I just tried the spin triple with an L, and it failed. With an S it also failed.


    But if I place a T like so:

    Code:
    %%%%T %%%%
    %%% TT%%%%
    %%%%T%%%%%
    
    and then rotate it at all, even clockwise once and counterclockwise once (to end up in the same position and orientation), it still counts as a T-spin. So you're right about "last successful command was a rotate".


    So in SRS, the rule as we know it is "if tetromino being locked is T AND last successful command was rotate left or rotate right AND 3 of the 4 squares diagonally adjacent to the T's center are occupied, trigger T-spin bonus." I should go add that to the wiki.
     
  9. Depends on how broad you want the definition to be. If you look closely in one of the Arika TGM3 videos, something counts as a T-Spin when there are only 2 filled diagonally adjacent spaces.
     
  10. niku

    niku Unregistered

    Thanks... I've read faqs and instructions on how to do it and it makes sense here, but when I try to rotate a t-block that way it pops back up to the top of the stack instead of sliding down where I want it to be. Every time. [​IMG]
     
  11. niku

    niku Unregistered





    Only for me, it always ends up like


    ________T_

    _______TTT

    XXXXXXXX_

    XXXXXXX___
     
  12. tepples

    tepples Lockjaw developer

    In Tetris DS:

    Code:
    |     |  |    T |
    |     |  |   TTT|
    |XXXXXX XT |  |XXXXXX X |
    |XXXXXXXXTT| => |XXXXXXXX |
    |XXXXXXX T |  |XXXXXXX |
    
    but
    
    |     |  |     |
    |     |  |     |
    |XXXXXX X T|  |XXXXXX X |
    |XXXXXXXXTT| => |XXXXXXXXT |
    |XXXXXXX T|  |XXXXXXXTTT|
    
     
  13. Hey guys, will this count as a T-Spin?


    Code:
    |    T | 
    |   TTT| 
    |XXXXXXXX | 
    |XXXXXXXX | 
    |XXXXXXXX | 
    |XXXXXXXX | 
    |XXXXXXXX | 
    |XXXXXXXXT | 
    |XXXXXXXXTT| 
    |XXXXXXXXTX|
    
     
  14. tepples

    tepples Lockjaw developer

    No. If the piece has moved down since rotation, even if only by gravity, then the last successful command is not "rotate"; it's "move down". I'll go clarify that on [[Twists]].
     
  15. X-Perts

    X-Perts Unregistered

    That's not a t-spin. Not because it goes down. It doesn't. It will get caught on the ledge. It's not a twist, because it is not surrounded by three occupied blocks.


    Edit: Oh sorry. I thaught you were twisting it in the other direction...
     
  16. Guest

    Guest Unregistered


    Oh. Thanks.



    Hmm.....
     
  17. Guest

    Guest Unregistered

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